Well, this email rises to the top of all the emails I have read from my fellow preachers...who claim "Now I'm not telling you who to vote for...but" So this is what following Jesus looks like today in America...I really, don't know what to say anymore...I dont care who you choose to vote for but if this is the way we leaders are going to lead our people, or this is the way we are going to frame the discussions of politics, I think we are in for dark days indeed...here is a selection of some of his most potent statements...
-Eric
"God spoke to me that after George W. Bush, America would elect its most ungodly president ever....
I had a vision earlier this year. I saw Barack Obama in this vision. He was speaking to a large crowd and being broadcast on television. He was speaking incredible words of unity, peace, and bringing all sides together; the words were elegant, the words were comforting, and the words were inspiring.
But while he was speaking I saw all a powerful spirit of violence coming out of his spirit feeding into the spirits of those that were hearing him. That spirit of violence was directed at anybody who opposed what he was saying. Those who heard his words and received it had the spirit of violence being implanted inside of them. It was a rage like I have not seen before. It was the rage that would be unleashed against those who oppose and stand in the way of Barack Obama's agenda. We are already seeing the beginnings of this spirit manifested here in America.
We now see it with Joe the plumber. These people who are under the influence of this demon spirit of rage desire to completely destroy this man because he dared to question Barack Obama
I want to put this deep in your spirit. I am speaking as a prophet. The words I'm about to tell you are "thus saith the Lord". If Barack Obama is elected, the attacks against free speech, against those who believe differently than he does, and the systematic use of the government and laws to silence the voice of fundamental Christians will be unlike anything ever seen in this nation before.
I am only speaking the words of thus saith the Lord,
But I want to remind you, every word God has spoken to me over the last eight years and every word which I have prophesied about the American government and the elections has come to pass.
God does not give this prophecy to scare us, but to prepare us.
Now you may be asking, "Are you saying that Barack Obama, if elected, would be America's most ungodly president ever?" Yes!
Now I'm not telling you who to vote for. Some people want an ungodly president. That's their choice. I have watched throughout the world, Christians support political leaders who are blatantly ungodly. So again, this is the people's choice.
The door has been opened and the way is being made for a one world government system to overtake the world's economics.
13 comments:
OK--Maybe I'm a simpelton, As a follower of Christ, I see my responsibility as follows:
Desire to know Him intimately;
Desire for my mind to be renewed by His Spirit and His Word;
Desire to do what I feel (at my current state of sanctification) would bring Him the most glory and honor.
Use the brain that He gave me and exercise that brain to its full capacity by studying the issues and researching all that I can.
To prayer for wisdom from above and to than vote and let the chips fall where they may.
I think most professing Christians know more about the candidates then they know about Christ! I truly think that that is the real problem.
Perhaps the real problem is that we are all still looking for a Messiah, because we have forgotten that we already have one.
that is whack... you know i'm an outspoken opponent of obama, but, dude.. better obama than the author of that letter in my opinion
Yah...this email almost...I say almost....made me vote for Obama...just out of religious spite.
Hi Eric,
This email is so disturbing to me.
"I am speaking as a prophet....thus saith the Lord."
Really? We have a close Senate race in Oregon, I have been troubled on which way to vote, do you think he could give a prophecy for me, or does he just do National Elections, I could use help on the P.T.A. choice as well if he could slip that in. Now I have a twinge of guilt using such sarcasm, but this kind of manipulation by using God's name in vain is a heineous betrayal of all that is holy. Now if he were to say he strongly believes such and such, okay, but this kind of bully pulpiting is close to a mental disorder in my estimation; yes, I know that is strong, but I believe it. Self-delusion, hyper-spiritual, self-exhalting claims like this scare me as well.
God is still in control, and if Obama wins and God chooses to disciple our nation with his influence as President, so be it and the outcome will be good. I have no fear of these forcasts. But we can be sure that our country will vote based on the majorities morality, and until Christian people become people that attract others and glorify God, we should expect a removing of the hand of protection from our country, but until this kind of holy arm-twisting ceases, we will have less and less impact on our culture. I hear this kind of thing more and more in the church, and it is nothing but fodder for SNL.
So disappointed,
Dad
P.S. the word code I have to type in to post is "crepi", ironic huh?
Interesting scripture to wrestle with.
God put Pharaoh into power?? What the....??
But he killed so many Jewish babies!!!??
Maybe God's ways are more mysterious than we think? We should be VERY CAREFUL not to say we are speaking for God - God speaks for himself, through his son Jesus and His living word. We are foolish to believe we have his plans figured out.
Romans 9:16
It does not, therefore, depend on man's desire or effort, but on God's mercy. 17For the Scripture says to Pharaoh: "I raised you up for this very purpose, that I might display my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth."[g] 18Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden.
-LeeElla
of course that's not to say any of the Isrealites would have "voted" for pharoah.... ;)
Is he or isn't he out of line? He very much feels that God has spoken to him, and last I checked prophesying didn't end during the Bible times. This is not a Bush-Clinton race. There are some core fundamental differences in this race and there is a potential for our country to go down a scary path. Of course God is always in control, but that doesn't mean he won't prepare us for certain battles.
This guy may be way out of line, could very well be a whack-job, but what if... not? A leader speaking such powerful accusations and calling it "thus saith the Lord" will certainly be judged for his words. I don't envy any pastor out there who will be judged for what he says publicly, and this isn't the first time I've seen a pastor speak loudly controversial things (wink wink:). How do we know for sure, except to line it up with the Word of God and have the Holy Spirit tell you for sure this wasn't of Him?
(Not saying I'm in line with the guy, just thinking out loud. Or perhaps I'm asking to be shred to bits...)
*Rach
p.s. I'm curious if anyone reads back this far anyway...
Rach
First of all no one is going to shred you to bits...the goal around here is to limit the threat of sneek attacks and back stabbing and pouncing...no promises, but I'm trying to clean up our play pen.
If God speaks to someone, thats fine...but your word is your word...soon as someone tells me how to vote and adds that God is going to judge me, or that a "spirit" is going to get me...I think that is way over the line.
As far as this controversial pastor goes...I can not recollect ever doing that to someone in such a manner...and if I did...someone should of slapped me.
The blending of Americanism, politics and Chrisitanity is a growing issue within fundamentalism...I see it heading towards the same extremes as we see in Islamic Fundamentalism.
Soon as we start evoking the great Satan over our political and cultural enemies...we are nto far from hanging them from trees, limiting their speech, imprisoning them, ostracizing them, using derogatory, defaming language and eventuall killing them.
We've burned people at the stakes in the name of religion...most of our best religious literature and scripture was penned in the prisons of the religious "RIGHT" be they jewish or religious or pagan.
I fear for the way of Jesus when it starts taking up the "sword" against each other be it literal or whatever...
Not that debate, dissagreement or lively reasoning fall into this catagory..its the spiritualization or your positions and ideology that leads to intolerance and the evils discussed.
In my opinion and I think history reveals that.
oh and trust me....people read way back to find all the stupid stuff I say and then from a rope to hang me with...or a case to try me with.
Boo, hoo, hoo...weep with my poor baby self. ;)
luvs to ya girl
Thanks for clarifying, Eric! I enjoy hearing your take on things, and I never meant to relate you to this kind of preaching - only that you've had your share of stirring the pot. I guess I have a hard time sharing the dramatic thoughts that being on guard against someone or something means we're that much closer to "hanging them from trees" or "heading towards the same extremes as we see in Islamic Fundamentalism". Do you not see that as dramatic, or are you simply on guard against us heading that direction? - Legit question, no sarcasm or argument just to argue (you can't hear my inflection:)
*Rach
I dont think my thoughts are based on speculation or being alarmist or over the top...they represent many realities around the globe where the freedom to vote and free speech are villainized.
I have no problem with him stating his opinion in whatever fashion he desires...he can be a christian shock jock for whoever but when you say "Thus Saith The Lord" I think any level headed American would take a step back and say "Whoa dude" let the weight of your positions or arguments give you authority not your prayer closet, visions or flashes of supposed spiritual insight."
People who have to have a:
"I am God...and I endorse this message"
tacked on to their political debate are in my opinion, unable to reason in a manner that wins the argument. Its a cop out for weak positions or immature dialectics.
We don't live in a culture that will bow to: "It says it in the bible" anymore, we have to reason in a broader way that includes morality and biblical truth but stands on the proof of why those postions are better for the country, for human relationships and for the good of the community. Simply forcing people out of fear, threats of demon possession or anything like that...puts you in the corner with the nuts, the whackos and the abortion clinic bombers.
It wasn't long ago that people were hanged in this country just for having black skin! Imagine if certain religious fanatics add that God told them so...thier opponents are filled with devils and that they are going to destroy God's best country on earth...you dont think that's a possibility?
There has already been one legitimate assassination plot foiled against Obama and remember Timothy McVeigh and Oklahoma City?
I sat and listened to a religious right speaker not long ago here in Spokane that referenced a time when committed pro-lifers burned down abortion clinics in good old America. Now I doubt that he was wanting us to go out and do that...I think? But couldnt a slightly kooky person take that rehtoric and assume that what we talk about, refrence and demonize should be treated in a like manner?
I really dont think those concerns are over the top...we live in a Columbine world now. Free Speech needs to be free but some of this stuff spilling out of certain circles is toxic and imbalanced.
It's like spilling gun powder all around and then saying your not to blame if someone lights a match?
Well what was your intent...huh?
Thats my take on it.
Yes. That makes absolute sense and is all too scary. There is definite influence from any religious leader over their audience. I guess we must be all the more in tune with the Holy Spirit and know our Bible!
On a lighter note, 2 Peter reminds us that those who prophesy falsely in the name of God will bring swift destruction on themselves.
I'm looking forward to tonight...
*Rach
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